UPDATE: No crime in Town Center death, officials determine

El Dorado County sheriff’s deputies converged on El Dorado Hills Town Center on June 12 after a construction worker found a woman’s body hanging in an enclosed trash area.

Though originally deemed suspicious — 911 calls made to the Sheriff’s Department the night before the body was discovered reported a woman screaming for help in the area — detectives have determined the victim, described as a Caucasian female, committed suicide, according Sgt. Jim Byers.

“We have absolutely no indication of any crime at all,” Byers said Monday. “We are unable to tie that (911) screaming call to our victim. There’s too much gray area there.”

Officials estimate the time of death sometime between 9 and 11 p.m. Monday, June 11.

Animal Services took a dog found resting in the shade next to the enclosure behind Town Center’s New Orleans Building about an hour after authorities were called at 9 a.m. last Tuesday. The dog belonged to the victim and has been reunited with family, Byers confirmed.

During the on-site investigation authorities cordoned off an area of the parking lot that serves businesses on Town Center’s southwest side, the closest of which is Reunion, a nightclub currently under construction on the New Orleans Building’s ground floor and just steps away from the trash enclosure.

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190 Comments for “UPDATE: No crime in Town Center death, officials determine”

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  1. kathy victorino

    Which animal shelter picked up the dog and is it up for adoption?

    • She has kids. Her kids may want the dog.

    • The concern for the dog is a nice gesture but I’m sure there is family to take care of her.

    • She was a friend of mine. She has children. This is a family dog the children had for most of their life. He is very old. I’m sure they will get the dog back. If they haven’t already.

  2. Thank you Kris, I didn’t want the dog to be without a home, but he/she has one and those kids will need that dog. So incredibly sorry for the family, they are in my heart and prayers.

  3. How terribly sad – and what a tragic end – to have your body discovered among garbage receptacles.

    Way to express callousness and insensitivity! What’s wrong with my community? What’s happening to our culture, when the very first comment places regard for a healthy canine above regret and dismay at the loss of human life? #Sheeple

    • Dear Think Sheepie

      All the way around this is a tragedy. You obviously didn’t read Kathy’s complete email. Although she may have mentioned the dog first, she absolutely conveyed her heartfelt sorrow for everyone concerned which by the way is much more than you did.

      • Correct: I read her post, the first one published here, and I responded specifically to that. Where is her email? Where can I read her complete message?

        Correct: she mentioned the dog first. Don’t you get it? That was my point – exactly. Dog > Person? Really? 😐

        “[…] which by the way is much more than you did.” – False, and I see what you tried to do there.

        Did you selectively miss my opening comment? Do you refuse to acknowledge that my entire post conveys the way I feel about this? Are you suggesting that the way I feel about it – that my feelings and opinions – are somehow less qualified than yours?

        We certainly agree that all the way around, this is a tragedy.

        • Why do you have to judge dog vs. human? Yes tragedy either way, but the dog is still alive and needs care, hence reasonable concern.

          • Agree with BT. The owner would’ve wanted for the dog to be in safe hands. Prayers go out to the family.

    • concerned and sad

      how was she to know this woman had kids? wasn’t in the article.

    • Dear Think Sheeple-

      You’re an idiot

  4. Who was this woman? Was she young? I wonder if she had a history of depression. It’s just so sad.

    • She was in her forties. She left behind 2 teenage sons and a wonderful family who loved her very much. She battled depression for years. I am extremely sad for her and her entire family who are absolutely devastated that such a wonderful woman felt so much despair that she took her own life.

  5. This is just so sad. I knew this lady and she was so nice and sweet. My condolenaces go out to the family.

  6. hello my name is nick king i live i rohnert park ca, and i would like to say how sorry i feel for this lady and the family she has left behind and i also feel alot of sadness for her dog which must have loved its owner a great deal to have stayed next to the dumpster enclosure waiting for its master to come back out from the inside of the enclosure because the dog was there at 5:45am when i got there and first saw the dog a called it to me petted it and still paitently awaiting its master at 9:30 or thereabouts when i went to give it some water and that is also when i had sad misfortune of find this lady hanging in the corner of the enclosure i just happen to love animals and the bad luck that the company i work for sent me to work in el dorado at reunions so whatever you 2 women are bickering about get over yourselves and think about what her famjly and yes even that poor loyal animal are going thru once again my sympathies and prayers go out to her family. thankyou, nick king

  7. This is so heartbreaking.Thoughts and prayers go out to the family and friends, and her beloved dog.

  8. Kim Item@KimItemMinistries

    2 hangings here in EDH [Zachary, a friend from O.R.H.S. & now this lady, mother, wife, dog owner] is- 2 too many here in EDH! May God Rest Their Souls… Thoughts, prayers, and tears go out for her family at this time.
    Also, This was a story down below I would like to share with you all, if I may- Especially for those who are going through tough times, pain, hurt, sadness, and possibly considering suicide. It really touches my heart and my Spirit, I hope and pray it does yours also… God Bless!

    ~The Magic of Three Days~
    An insightful Easter message on how to trust God’s timing when dealing with your problems, hurts, pains, and more.
    By Patt Barnes, Milwaukee, Wisconsin

    It was a beautiful spring day, and a sense of peace stayed with me as I left the Cathedral on Easter Monday morning. I paused for a moment on top of the steps leading to the Avenue, now crowded with people rushing to their jobs. Sitting in her usual place inside a small archway was the old flower lady. At her feet corsages and boutonnieres were parading on top of a spread-open newspaper.
    The flower lady was smiling, her wrinkled old face alive with some inner joy. I started down the stairs-then, on an impulse, turned and picked out a flower.
    As I put it m my lapel, I said, “You look happy this morning.” “Why not? Everything is good.”
    She was dressed so shabbily and seemed so very old that her reply startled me, “You’ve been sitting here for many years now, haven’t you? And always smiling. You wear your troubles well.”
    “You can’t reach my age and not have troubles,” she replied. “Only it’s like Jesus and Good Friday . . .” She paused for a moment.
    “Yes?” I prompted.
    “Well, when Jesus was crucified on Good Friday, that was the worst day for the whole world. And when I get troubles I remember that, and then I think of what happened only three days later-Easter and our Lord arising. So when I get troubles, I’ve learned to wait three days . . . somehow everything gets all right again.”
    And she smiled goodbye. Her words still follow me whenever I think I have troubles . . . “Give God a chance to help . . . wait three days.”

  9. concerned and sad

    What was her name? I am so sad for the entire family and would like offer support. Nick King, So sad you had to witness that. I was wondering who made the discovery, my son hangs out down there and I was so worried it was a young person. I think the concern for the dog is an automatic response and includes sadness for the life lost, the family left behind.

    • I’m so sorry to the person (Nick King) who found her and I think it was very kind of you to post. Thank you!

      As for the family ……


      Let them grieve privately with friends and family. They do not need the world to be involved. The children have a right to privacy they just lost their Mother! And there is no reason to know names!

  10. Despite what was published, or dispite whether or not she had a history of depression, I have a very hard time believing she committed suicide. I heard her screams for help!! It was Monday night, I went to bed around 1230 a.m., cracked my window, and heard a woman screaming “HELP!, HELP ME! I could hear the distress and anguish in her voice. This went on for at least 40min. I called the police twice. The first time I called there was a patrol car in the area, but not on foot, searching already. The second time I called the police, approx 15 min later, I asked them if they were still searching because we (my husband and I), still heard the screams for help. I told the dispatcher and a policeman that we thought the screams were coming from either the park (right accross the street from town center), the nature preserve, or as far away as Town Center. After the second time calling the police, additional units were sent out, and they were searching on foot, but by that time the screams had stopped. From how this woman was screaming for help, this didn’t sound like a woman who wanted to die!! I will go to my grave never believing this woman committed suicide!

    • Concerned – my son showed me a Facebook post that said the same thing around the same time frame, there was somebody screaming for their life. You are not the only one who saw this, or called 911. I totally agree with you. Something isn’t right here.

      • Deb-Thanks, good to know, I knew there was at least one other person who called 911.

  11. Concerned –

    Do you think this is helpful to anyone involved? Do you think the family needs to read this? The sons? Please for the sake of the children if for no one else delete your post. You are entitled to your opinion on the matter but I just don’t think this is something children should read. This could be very hurtful to them. I’m sure the Sheriff’s Dept has investigated and that the family has the details surrounding what happened. The Father should decide what details he thinks the children can handle….no one else.

    • Number one, I highly doubt the sons are reading this, but, do you think it’s helpful for the sons to believe their mother left them that way if that’s not what happened?? Also, I guess you have more faith in the Shereffs Dept than I do. How can the Sheriffs dept determine it was a suicide in less than 24hrs, but when I called and spoke with a detictive, she told me it was still an ongoing investigation. Something just doesn’t jive.

      • Then I am pleading with you to delete this. You don’t know all is the details and this will make it infinitely more painful. I’m truely sorry if you heard what you heard but putting this idea out there for anyone close to the family will bring nothing but pain and additional anguish.
        And yes I do believe it is very possible that they could read this. This is a small community and people close have been reading the comments.

  12. Her boys are as smart as their mother, and will want and deserve the truth.

    • sad and concerned

      How can they determine the manner of death without a coroners report? Odd that this hasn’t been in any news stories other than Mtn Democrat and Village Life. I think being a EDH citizen, I would like to know for certain if there is or was someone out to hurt women. Also if our kids are going there to meet friends etc. If the family wish to withhold the name, I completely support that of course, but I think the Sheriff’s department will have to release an official statement. Especially now.

    • Yes they deserve the truth I don’t disagree with that but that is not for anyone here to decide what the truth is. And it most certainly should not be learned here. Do you think anyone needs to know every last detail. This was a tragedy and people knowing every last detail doesn’t help anyone. Especially when it’s plastered here for the world to see.

      If this is the way you feel that everyone needs to know everyone else’s business then I truly feel sorry for you all but most of all the people that can potentially be hurt by this. Anyone who relishes in the pain of others or chooses to fuel the speculation of something more sinister needs to consider how they would feel if this happen to someone close to them. Who would want all of the details out there for all the world to see? Would you want that image in your head for the rest of your life if you knew all the details of someone’s suffering? Have some compassion.

      Enough said …..

      • Yes, enough said is right! You’ve made your point, but I don’t agree. I’m simply trying to to get the truth out there, and no one is discussing everyone’s business. And yes it is the truth, straight from sgt Byers, and other officials who admit there were 911 calls. I think its so much easier for some people to swollow that this woman comitted suicide, than to consider the alternative. If this bothers you stop looking. Who made you Den Mother??

      • This is a community newspaper and it is the place to share relevant community information. It is human nature and good personal policy to inquire and express relevant information about community interests, especially if they intimately involve you. Both the person who found the woman and the one who heard disturbing screams in the middle of the night were/are intimately involved (like it our not). Their voices are important. They have something of value to offer to us. Unlike you, the religious proselytizer and the eventual blight of political zealots – they were there.

      • Thank you

  13. Ok, now we have an “update”, which basically tells us nothing new other than they are now admitting there were 911 calls. What I don’t understand is, how they cannot tie the 911 calls together with the woman found, considering the screaming was heard in the same area this woman was found, and the screaming was heard the night before the woman was found. I understand the police cannot give details, but, I just hope they are investigating this thoroughly, and havn’t given up.

  14. I agree with sad and concerned ! We want to know for sure, and I’m sure her kids would too.

  15. There is nothing more sad than hearing of someone who felt they had no other alternative but to take their own life. Totally breaks my heart. Although we now live out of state, I heard about his tragedy from my son last night. We moved from EDH, and still have many, many friends there. I too, am an animal lover, and hope that her dog will be reunited with her family; but right now all I can think about is the family and what they must be going through.

    I hope that once the authorities release more conclusive information, the community up on the hill can rally around the family and help them in any way possible. Regardless as to the outcome of the police investigation, we have to remember this was truly a tragedy and I am hopeful it won’t turn in to a media circus, for the sake of the family.

    My thoughts and prayers go out to her family during this trying time.

  16. I am the sister in law of this beautiful person that is now gone from this world and our lives.. I don’t know what some on this page are looking for but to put speculation out to make this situation even more difficult for all of us, her children and the numerous children in our family that dearly loved her. She had an illness that tragically took her life. Her dog was very protective over her and would not have allowed anyone to hurt her. Please put this to rest and let the details to be as private as possible…my she finally rest in peace.. I will miss your beautiful smile sister… I love you

    • I am truly sorry for your loss. You have to understand though, when something like this happens in your community, there will be alot of fears, anxiety and concern. I’m sure no one here is trying to be hurtful, or trying to get attention, and are only acting out of concern (most people are not even using their own names). In my case, after hearing those screams for help, I’ve been seriously distrought ever since. There was very little information out there, and nothing mentioned of the 911 calls. I merely wanted to to tell my story to help, not hurt anyone. Now that the 911 calls have been revealed, if you and your family want me to delete my post, I’ll be happy to do so. Again, I’m very sorry for what you and your family are going through.

  17. I recently met her, liked her immediately, although through conversations with her I knew she was troubled….but the way she talked about her love for her sons and her dog was truly unconditional. She showed me pics of them for hours while I shared pics of my own child and dogs. Knowing the behavior of dogs so loyal to their owners, I have a hard time believing her dog would have gone unharmed through the speculated ordeal involving another party. Let’s stop ASSuming, let her family grieve and allow law enforcement officials do their jobs. The truth will come out. No one here is Matlock. If there really was some crazed killer I think our community officials respect us enough to say something. Let her rest in peace.

    • You yourself are speculating, yet, chastizing others for doing the same. Are you not assuming or speculating about the dog?? People are expressing their views. That’s what this forum is for.

  18. I can’t believe some of you have turned this into an argument with each other!!!! Really, Wth is your problem?? Like her sister has said….leave it private for the sake of the family…share your compassion and quit bickering with each other. I might be young, but I can see how childish this is.

  19. Worried EDH citizen

    I think people, like me, just want to know if there is a murderer in our community or not.

    • Agreed, I want to know too. Just saying people shouldn’t be arguing about it, because no one knows for sure what happened.

  20. Why is there no info on the 911 call or the incident with the body being found on the sheriffs log?

  21. hello my name is nick king as some of you know from reading or following these post i had the sad misfortune and bad luck to be the person that found this poor woman and i saw her and still do in my sleep and it gives me some sort of comfort(for lack of any other way to describe my feelings) to know that when i found her and the 911 call was made she was found or going home or im not sure how to express it i just knew she wasnt going to be in that dumpster enclosure anymore and the other way that i feel is really creeped out because i cant shake what i saw that day out of my head so when i saw what im about to say it is only dirrected at just a few people that feel like they need some sort of attention so like a large metal can with a few rocks in it it makes a lot of noise and disturbs people and i happen to be one of the people that is getting disturbed and i have to ask what kind of SICK SOCIETYdo you come from or live in to start the kind of smut ive just read it was bad enough to have to live with these mental snapshots of what i stumbled upon i sure as hell dont want your twisted ideas joining them i regret the day i ever heard of el dorado hills even more after reading some of what has been written as moondog stated i am involved no matter how much id rather not i feel like i need to know something more about this poor woman who left her kids ,husband,a sister in law ,a dog and im sure a mother and father that im sure loved and cared for her very much i wish i had the opportunity to meet them to express my sympathy and tell them im sorry for their lose i want to know who she was why she did what she felt she had to do what made her take that path and didnt she realize how many peoples lives she was going to touch and affect people like me i dont know when ill be able to stop thinking or having dreams about what i saw that day later than soon i think and from what i saw that day in my heart i saw a woman who had come to the end of her life by her own doing im a construction worker i dont claim to be a cop or no anything about crime scenes i can only state what i saw ( i hope this doesnt come out wrong or is misunderstood) and what i hope for her family i saw a woman whose clothes were not torn or looked like she had been in any sort of altercation her hair was in a pony tail and didnt look like it had been pulled or yanked on as you might interpret from reading one or two earlier postings also her dog didnt have any injuries that i could see or tell nor was it skittesh to me a perfect stranger a with that all being said i would like to say something i used to hear when i was much younger “IF YOU DONT HAVE ANYTHING NICE TO SAY SHUT THE HELL UP” her family has enough to deal with im sure they rather not hear your conspricy theories let the cops do there jobs as for me if anybody that new this woman could let me know her name or when and if there is going to be some sort of service for her or anything that could help me to put some sort of closure to what im dealing with i would truly appreciate it …….thank you ,nick king

    • Nick I am so sorry… I would love to tell you about my lovely sister in law…my heart aches for what you have been dealing with but am grateful you have the caring heart you have.. I don’t know how to get in contact with you other than here.. I will try to figure out a way to privately get a message to you so we can talk and I can get service information to you.. you are in my prayers ..God Bless you 🙂

      • sad and concerned

        You both can get into contact with the editor, I am certain that person would assist and keep it confidential. Nick what it sounds like is Post Traumatic Stress, please don’t dismiss it or try to ignore it. I too have witnessed something similar and addressing PTSD is crucial to moving on. Please do so.

  22. no one cares who my name is anyways...

    thank you for your words. they bring me peace and comfort i needed, i too like you, regret the day i ever heard of el dorado hills (I totally agree with You on that!) this whole town is messed up, backwards, and troubled, and needs help, lots of help, i wish like you, i wish i could leave too, i wish i could never ever come back, its that bad, sad but true, i hope your mind heals, sorry you had to be the one to find her, but fate has its ways-, since no one else i have met here in this town, since i got here, i was brought here, has any compassion at all for others, none other than thinking of themselves only, and no one else but themselves, and this town may be pretty on the outside, ‘smiles everyone, lights, camera, action, cameras are rolling, places everyone’, oh boy, looks can and are very deceiving to the people coming to visit here, but once you move in and live on the inside, it is full of hate, thieves, angry, mean, godless people that smile outwardly but are full of malice, deception, hate, that cause people like this lady who was fragile, to end it all, and for others who are also fragile to end it all temporarily, by drinking their misery away, and i know you said; “IF YOU DONT HAVE ANYTHING NICE TO SAY SHUT THE HELL UP” so I will now stop talking, writing, i feel better now, I hope you do too, soon, please, take care

    • I agree with you on the type of people we live amongst here in this town. Its so full of shiny, ticky tacky, desperate housewives. Its also sad that children are being raised to become mirror images. I am sorry for her children that I know will miss her terribly.

  23. Nick king- I know a little about this lady and I’m sure I can figure out the name if you need- email me (please nobody but nick king) my address is shellspafford@gmail.com and I would be more than happy to give you some information. I can’t say I know, but I am sure that I can help a little bit.

  24. EDH Sad & Concerned

    My wife and I have not stopped thinking of this poor woman’s family since we heard of this tragic event through “rumors” on Tuesday afternoon. We learned like everyone else on this tread by going on-line to read the story. No local news, no statement from the Sheriff, no flowers left at the site. I have to say that I’ve lived in this community now for over 10 years and what has impressed me the most is that this EDH community has always felt like a large family. Everyone seems to know each other. We feel sad together when we drive past the “rock” and see a sad message left behind. We smile when we see a proud parent paint a happy birthday or congratulatory message on it. This whole thread started by a concerned citizen asking or wanting to help with the dog. We have 2 teenage boys that most likely know this family. This happened in the heart of our community and its just so sad. I wish the Sheriff would make a statement so this thread could be used more effectively to support this family in our awesome community. Peace be with you all.

  25. This is my aunt you guys are talking about and although she did suffer from mental illness she was an amazing, beautiful, intelligent woman. Who left behind family, friends and students who loved her dearly! We know she took her life and to think she was hanging there regretting what she had done screaming for help and no one was there for her breaks my heart to pieces! We are all devastated and don’t need more pain to add on to our tragic, confusing loss 🙁

  26. Can we leave it alone now? If I was a family member I’d focus on my grief more than convincing everyone its a suicide and how she did it. Just stop. People are starting to question your motives

  27. Nick Bernardoni

    My friend who I was with and I heard the screaming that night. He is the one who called 911. All I can say is that it was screaming that I hope we never have to hear again.

  28. For the people who did know this lady, please understand the concern of those who heard the screaming that night. If you heard screams for help and the next day there was a death its only reasonable to think it was this lady. If they could only understand all our concern. This is a news article where information is shared with the community and comments are enabled for just that purpose. Nobody is trying to disrespect the family whatsoever.

  29. I got to know her personally through frequenting the same venue, and she was a wonderful, caring, beautiful, bubbly, and fun woman and I will miss her dearly. She was dear to my friends and I, and my heart goes out to her family with the utmost sincerity. God bless, you are all in my prayers.

  30. Really now. I smell bologna. I know if my wife went missing for 12 hours you better believe this town would know and would be turned upside down. I don’t care what officials have determined, I’m not buying what there selling.

    No sheriff logs indicating any missing persons call was made.

  31. O.k. so who was the woman screaming that night, in which the police themselves admitted to hearing?? Not to mention others that have shared that they heard screams for help in the same area at the same time. Is it really possible that a woman hung herself right before another woman was screaming for her life in the same area? This is totally bogus. How stupid do they think we are?? Better yet, why all the secrecy?

  32. Has anyone asked Sac Bee or KCRA or other news org why this didn’t warrant a story or an acknowledgement?

  33. This is seriously starting to piss me off! My aunt had issues leave it at that and let my family remember the wonderful times we spent with such a bright person. Nick King please reach out I’m deeply sorry and am here for you. I am heartbroken but I know my wonderful aunt is with an amazing man my lord and savior so please for my sake and the sake of my family please stop. Those of you who want to speculate please I’m begging pick another venue. This isn’t the place. I’m sure you have town meetings or some sort of social gathering amungst the people of your community. I loved her so very much and reading about her crying for help doesn’t make this easier for me. So please please stop. There is no murderer on the loose. My family will appreciate some discretion.

    • Dear Robert nephew,
      I am truly sorry for your loss, but, because of the public nature of the act that occurred, you have to realize the concern of the public. There are so many unanswered questions, and very little information given. I just learned of a mother in the area flagging down a police officer, reporting a teenager missing that very same night. Could that have been the daughter screaming for help? Did they find her? We don’t know, because nobody is being given an inforfation. Why are you so sure your aunt committed suicide? Was the note?I urge you, your family, and or the police come out and make a formal statement. That is the only way alleviate the fears and concern. I heard definite cries for help that night. Am I suppose to just forget about it? Not care?

  34. Here’s something for all of you want to be detectives:
    Mountain Democrat Crime Log for June 12-13

    June 12th – 12:45 am (same time frame)
    Unknown adult female flagged down deputies on Town Center Blvd in EDH for assistance in locating a missing 17 yr old female juvenile.

    Maybe it was one of these two you heard.

    • You again! I think it is awfullly suspicious that you seem intent on steering people away from talking about this. Are you working for the police?? Are you one of the Merchants in the area who are concerned people want come and frequent your shop? Why are you acting like this affects you personally? So here’s one for you detective…Why no mention of this from the police?? Why are they giving us so little information? If they could explain away the screams for help they would of already. Do you know what it’s like to hear a woman scream for her life for 40min, not be able to help, and then find out a woman is dead the next morning. This HAS affected ME personally, and turned my life upside down. I am NOT enjoying this. I will remember those screams the rest of my life. So stop preaching about things you don’t know about! You wern’t there! I, in a way, was there. I want answers! I want answers for the woman screaming that night, for the community, and yes, for myself. Again, I urge the family and the police to come out with a formal statement.

      • Sad and Concerned

        I said this in reply to Nick King’s last posting and will to you as well. You may be suffering from Post Traumatic Stress, please deal with it. Doesn’t go away, trust me, had to get help for myself for it a long time ago and wish I hadn’t waited years to do so. My story doesn’t need to be told here but something similar and you may well need a little guidance through the process.

  35. Ive seen that when this all came about. I am sure the sherrifs would have linked the 2 together and updated the public in an effort to extinguish any confusion and all this back and forth BS. Again thats just my opinion.The screams described here by the 911 callers are screams of anguish.I could understand a mothers anxiety in trying to locate her teenager but is there reports of her screaming loudly? It states she flagged down a patrol car that was in the area probably from the first 911 caller. Again like before just my opinion.

    Where’s the log for the 911 call reporting the screams that were heard or even the discovery?

    Secrecy huh???

  36. My heart really goes out to the two teenage boys this woman left behind, it breaks my heart. I am sorry for the family’s loss and the pain you are currently going through. I have been reading the comments and would have to agree with the many folks who are questioning the secrecy of this all. I am wondering why the woman’s name has not been released yet as obviously the next of kin has been notified. EDH Kids makes a good point, why did the husband not report her missing? I remember one time going for a walk in the early evening and ended up at a neighbor’s house and my husband could not find me and canvassed the neighborhood in his truck and my kids on their bikes looking for me and this was 7pm at night and I was gone for about 2 hours so to be missing all night and no report to the police sounds extremely odd to me. Maybe there is a reasonable explanation for that we do not know but you must admit it does appear suspicious. It appears that several of you have been affected by this and I know if I heard or found someone I would be too and I hope that you are able to get help. For the family of this woman you need to understand that whatever happened has affected these people, they did not ask for this so please understand they need closure too. Again, no disrespect to the woman’s family but the comments from some of the family members to leave it alone seem peculiar to me as if anything ever happened to me I would want my family to know the truth or make sure they find out as things are not always as they seem.

  37. I truly understand the family wanting privacy on this however because this took place in public there’s going to be public opinions/perspective on the matter.It would be a 180 degree turn of opinions had this occurred in her own home.
    People of this town need to stop thinking they are flawless and that this is the perfect town where nothing bad can happen.Whether you like it or not murder,suicide, and crimes are a part of life just as the celebration of things that are good like the birth of your own child.

    Are the people crying for the questions to cease that fragile? If people are easily offended they shouldn’t be hanging out on a news site where news gets posted of crimes, deaths, murders, and the occasional suicides.

    Nobody here questioning what went on that night is invading the privacy of the victims family. People need to ease up, is there a cover up conspiracy or something going on?

    I have had friends and acquaintances who commited suicide and there was not this much secrecy surrounding what happened. Everything was in black and white clear as crystal. Any gray area was invistigated and cleared up as it should be. I suppose sheriff deputies and detectives have too much on there plate or much more important things to spend there time on.

  38. Well first, she and her husband were going through a divorce and they didn’t live together…hence why she wasn’t reported missing. Second, can someone explain to me why the guy who found her had to unlatch the doors to the dumpster which were locked from the OUTSIDE?

    • Who said the latch was locked from the outside? Do not stir the pot without facts?

      • teverbrook-
        The Moutain Democrat has this article with comments posted just like this one. One person asked the question regarding was the door to the dumpster enclosure locked from the outside. Another person commented on that, stating that her son was one of the young men who found this woman, and her son did have to unlatch the door from the outside.

    • This is going to seem odd, but is her husbands name Dan?

  39. JUST KIDDING about the Tattinger Court thing…one of my friends sent me the article this morning and I realize it was from 2009 until I realized Joanne Witt lived there. He’s fired.

  40. Check the comments over on mt democrat, its from there.

    If they were indeed latched, thats the nail in the coffin right there. There is just too much BS.

    They estimate her dying between 9 and 11. There are guards that walk the area during that time. Would they have not seen that lady walking her dog, or atleast see the dog alone without its owner. Have they even questioned the guards that were on duty that evening. Have they checked the victims phone records to see who was last to have maybe talked to her? Even if we could put a time approximately when she was in town center would clear alot of the confusion in the air. There should be more investigation work done on this, they should reach out and question people who frequent the area around that time to see if anything suspicious was going on.

    Its hard for me to think nobody saw anything. What about the closed circuit tv surveillance in the target parking lot. Better yet is there CCTV on the new orleans building.

    I call BS

  41. They have checked her cell phone records and called everyone she called that night. I just know that area and I know that there are security guards around between 9-11pm and I know there are lots of people sitting outside having drinks in the summer evenings at Bistro and Cafe and you mean to tell me NO ONE heard anything?

  42. There’s cameras at the entrance side of Target that may have caught something in the distance. And also the latch is on the outside of the dumpster enclosure door making it impossible for someone to latch it once inside.

  43. The screams were heard after midnight, after the guards shift.

  44. I know they checked her cell phone records because I know her and we have a lot of friends in common. As far as the security guards – I frequently hang out in Town Center between 9-11pm – I always see them. I think it’s b.s. that the time of the incident has been estimated between 9-11 – there are people at Target getting off of work during those hours and Target is open until 10! Come on.

  45. Anyone have any idea why the EDSO Records Daily Activity Log has no report of this particular incident?

  46. Wow…. I mistakenly checked the boxes to update my email when there were any updates…big mistake! I am really over the comments about being “concerned” the police department reported things as they are..period! The enclosure was not locked, the police dept completed a thorough investigation and we know what happened to our sister… You don’t need to know her name or anything else about her life… IT’S NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS!!! no one affiliated with what happen to my sister is coming to get you!!! Stop using her death to be a bunch of busy bodies (specifically the person calling themselves concerned) Get a life, find something else to occupy your time. If you are truly affected by what you heard… Get some help, I don’t think that continuing your mission here is good for anyone and continuing to use my sisters death to fuel your patron place crappy is seriously getting on my nerves! All of you that entertain her/him are just as sad! Unchecking the update box you people are pathetic!

    • This is where you are wrong this is my business, I am a tax payer and my tax dollars helps to pay the salaries of the EL Dorado County Sherriff’s department and this incident took place in a public place which makes it my business to find out the truth. Had this happened in your sister private residents it would not be my business but it did happen and in my community and backyard as I drive past this dumpster every time I shop at Target and now I will drive by knowing a woman lost her life there and that makes me sad. All this could be put to rest if the EDSCO comes out with more information that makes sense and they have not hence all the speculation that is flying around. Did they do their job? Did they question everybody? I don’t know this but from what I have read it appears they did not. Honestly, I do not know what to believe or not believe anymore and EDSCO are not giving out any information expect is was a suicide and yet we have several folks that heard screaming that night along with one mother stating her son found your sister and the latch was on the dumpster??? The EDCSO is not doing their job and I know if I did not do my job my a** would be fired!!! We as tax payers are paying them to protect and server! Is there a cover –up???
      As far as your sister’s name, I did not mean it as I needed to know her name but again, the information for the EDSCO is not forthcoming and if you pick up any newspaper where someone was murdered, killed, died in a car accident and the next of kin has been notified they always include the name, age and where the person was from right there in black and white. Why in this case is that information being withheld, again with all the secrecy of this case it is very peculiar. You may have more facts than we do but you need to understand this happened in a PUBILC PLACE which affects many people, we did not ask for this to happen but it happened and we have the right again as tax payers to know as this was made our business based on where it took place.

      • Well said. I completely agree. And you have to realize that there are a lot of women out there who have always felt safe walking to their cars late at night after having dinner or drinks with friends in Town Center…I WAS one of them, now I don’t know if some crazy person is out there or not. I really think someone needs to make a formal statement and clear up some of these rumors flying around. When Joanne Witt was murdered we knew everything within 48 hours. Where I grew up someone committed suicide in a public place and we knew all the details within 48-72 hours and there were ZERO rumors flying around because the police made sure everyone knew there was no crazy murderer to worry about.

        • concerned and concerned2 one in the same?

          They did let ever one know that… the headline on this very article “No crime”…. LET IT GO PEOPLE… you know there was a women that committed suicide and there was no murder…. is there something else you are looking for???? BUSY BODIES plain and simple

  47. concerned and concerned2 one in the same?

    I agree with the sister, in reading your numerous post and specifically your last regarding being a taxpayer and that the police department needs to do their job… NEWS FLASH they did! It seems you are just not willing to accept that because you have nothing better to do. As to the speculation, do you think you may be playing a role in that? As for this tragedy making sense, suicide almost never makes sense. You are spreading information that is NOT true and has not been reported anywhere regarding the enclosure being locked and her son finding her so stop trying to make this into in your words “a cover up” and acting as if you are so concerned that you need to know all the details. Her sister said the police did an investagation… dont you think if there was a “cover up” her family would persue that? given they know all of the details of her life and what happened to her they have accepted the police findings? Your comments to people that they must be working with the police department to help in this “cover up” (a little out there) If driving by this “public place” makes you sad, have you gotten counseling or is this mission you are on in this blog what helps you? Is it your sadness that makes you continue with the speculation and rumors regarding something you dont know all the details of? It just seems to me that you are obsessed and won’t accept things as they are. The sister is correct, you know all you need to know, the rest of the gruesome details you are looking for are not going to be devulged to you…. GET OVER IT and quit trying to make this about being concerned… she is right you are a busy body!

    • First Concerned, and Concerned2 are not one in the same, although I agree with everything she said. Secondly, obviously a lot of people disagree with you, and sister in law about the police doing their jobs. How could the police have done their jobs when they determined it was suicide in less than 24hrs? I’ll ask again, was there a note?? I don’t think so, because I think you, or sister in law, or police would of mentioned it. So why the plea to leave it alone? Why the anger about someone revealing there are other facts to consider surrounding her death? Sister in law and other family have written in implying that was their loved one screaming for help, so again why so sure? You the family wern’t there, why are you so desparately trying to convince people it was suicide when there IS other evidence out there? More importantly, why is it you don’t want to even know about any other facts or evidence out there. Your actions are odd and suspicious. If it were my mother or sister, regardless of history of depression or not, I would want to know everything. We don’t need to know all the gruesome details, but we need to know something, which isn’t being provided. As far as the the dumpster enclosure being locked from the outside, it was an eye witness account, the person who witnessed it has no reason to lie about that. You can call me all the names you want, or try to shame people into shutting up, but I’ll tell you, its not going to work with me. This whole situation is very bizarre and diturbing. The manner in which this woman died, the screaming for help in the middle of the night, the lack of investigation, and information being given, the fact about the dumpster door being locked from the outside, and the bizarre actions of some family members pleaing for people to shut up, and accept what is impossible for people to accept right now. So, this person writing in, YOU, give it up, your harrassment, and insults arn’t going to work. I’m proud I live in a community where people arn’t going to burry their heads in the sand, and are going to stand up and do the right thing!

      • concerned and concerned2 one in the same?



          • concerned and concerned2 one in the same?

            You are so strange..no one is trying to protect anyone…. her family posted on this blog, a niece, her nephew and her sister… and the police said she committed suicide… Good Luck Lady… I will pray for you to get help in dealing with whatever your dealing with

          • No, you do not deserve to know. The police ruled it a suicide and how they came to that is no ones business. If you have facts poiting in another direction, do not put them here, go to the police.

    • Clearly you do not process what you are reading as it is very clear from the content of my comments, Concerned2 , than those of Concerned that we are 2 different people hence you accepting the findings of the investigation although I whole hearted agree with everything she is saying about this being puzzling. First off, if you read my comments I never said it was reported that the doors were latched I said that the mother of the son that said he found her said the doors were latched and also stated there is so much speculation flying around that I do not know what to believe anymore so DO NOT TWIST MY WORDS…clearly you have a tough time comprehending what you are reading! Facts, you want facts, well the EDSD is saying that the time of death is between 9pm and 11pm right, this is a fact but yet the screams which they do acknowledge were reported at 12:30am and last for approximately 40 minutes…let’s see I am no mathematician but that would be around 1:15am….So if the woman was dead between 9-11 and screams were heard after that who was screaming..that is over 2 hours after her death if it occurred at 11pm as the EDSD claims and this post from a family member (BELOW) supposedly states she was hanging there screaming for her life and regretted what she had done…tell me this HOW DOES A DEAD WOMAN SCREAM??? AND THE FAMILY IS ACCEPTING THIS??? Two people called into the EDSD that I am aware of that heard the screaming perhaps they should be checking the pond for another woman! The pieces of this puzzle do not add up and you are asking everyone to just believe what we are told. I would much rather be a busy body than someone who is lazy and just believes everything. AND HERE IS A NEWS FLASH… I am a tax payer and my tax dollars are being wasted and I do have a right to know what is happening in my community. I do not want to the details of this woman’s life I want to know how the EDSD determined this to be a suicide so quickly and how they came to their conclusion as this again happened in a PUBLIC PLACE. My 12 year old son heard about this and he was the one who told me about the dog leash and my husband did not know a thing about it so guess what people are talking about it and WHY YOU ASK, BECAUSE IT HAPPENED IN A PUBIC PLACE, do you honestly think if it happened in her home we would all be here right now… I THINK NOT! In a bit over a week there will be thousands of people converging upon the Towne Center for 4th of July fireworks do you think this will not be topic of discussion??? I guarantee it will be NO I WON”T EVEN BE THERE… but the speculation will be there because EDSD is not forthcoming with their investigation!

      1. Family
      June 16, 2012 – 5:12 pm

      This is my aunt you guys are talking about and although she did suffer from mental illness she was an amazing, beautiful, intelligent woman. Who left behind family, friends and students who loved her dearly! We know she took her life and to think she was hanging there regretting what she had done screaming for help and no one was there for her breaks my heart to pieces! We are all devastated and don’t need more pain to add on to our tragic, confusing loss

      • concerned and concerned2 one in the same?

        GET A LIFE LADY…. (concerned and concerned2… wink wink)

        • Well said!!

          You people with all of your theories. What part of what the EDCSD has said DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND? originally deemed suspicious later deemed suicide. WHAT’S MISSING? Her medical records which are private and cover by HIPAA??

          And I believe the niece said “TO THINK” she was hanging there because some inconsiderate person choose to put a time frame on what she thought she heard.

          I ask you ALL

          when someone close to you dies do you want to think of there suffering? No you hope they didn’t suffer. This is the same whether natural causes, terminal illness or something more tragic.

          And for someone to put a time frame on it?

          And no “Concerned” I have no affiliation with Town Center, the merchants or law enforcement.

  48. The most disturbing part of this…plain and simple: The guy who found her SAID HE had to UNLOCK THE DOORS TO GET INTO THE ENCLOSED TRASH AREA. Unless the dog has opposable thumbs…

    • Actually, go back and read his posts….He never said he had to unlock the door. He said (copied rom his post above)….

      i saw a woman whose clothes were not torn or looked like she had been in any sort of altercation her hair was in a pony tail and didnt look like it had been pulled or yanked on as you might interpret from reading one or two earlier postings also her dog didnt have any injuries that i could see or tell nor was it skittesh to me a perfect stranger

      Leave the family alone. If you are so concerned, go to the sherrifs office and discuss it with them They have done their job. If you disagree with them, take all of your factS based on crazy posts and make them change their mind. I can put all the “facts” on this website I want. BTW…the crime happened in the library with a candlestick. Now that I said it, it must be true or it is a hint to get a CLUE.

      • Your right he never did mention he had to unlock or unlatch the gate.

        But do your research. He said that the dog waited outside the enclosure waiting for its master to come back out from inside.

        “her dog which must have loved its owner a great deal to have stayed next to the dumpster enclosure waiting for its master to come back out from the inside of the enclosure “

  49. GUESS WHAT? On another forum this was posted:

    Anonymous June 19, 2012 – 9:10 pm

    Was there any mention of the dumpster doors being locked from the outside or anything? As a woman who lives in El Dorado Hills and frequents the establishments in Town Center – often times at night, I’d like to know I’m not in danger when walking to my car. Not to mention, I’ve hung out there enough to know that between 9-11pm there are actually security guards that walk around near that area and no one heard anything? No one outside drinking at Bistro or Cafe? Interesting.

    mommapd67 June 20, 2012 – 7:39 am

    Yes they were latched from the outside. My son is the one who unlatched open the doors after his friend had looked over the wall and saw her there

  50. Locked and latched are two different things. A comment from the mt democrat said it was latched not locked. It can only be latched from the outside period.
    People need to pay more attn to detail.
    Also here is some detail from nick kings comment

     ” I also feel alot of sadness for her dog which must have loved its owner a great deal to have stayed next to the dumpster enclosure waiting for its master to come back out from the inside of the enclosure because the dog was there at 5:45am when i got there and first saw the dog a called it to me petted it and still paitently awaiting its master at 9:30 or thereabouts when i went to give it some water and that is also when i had sad misfortune of find this lady hanging in the corner of the enclosure ”

    If the dog was waiting outside the enclosure does that mean it was indeed closed keeping him from entering and being at the feet of his owner??? As stated the dog waited for its master to come back outside the enclosure.

    Why havent they looked into the cctv from target?

    This is a bunch of BS.
    i dont make near the amount of money these sheriffs and detectives do but for there salary they indeed did a piss poor job from the eyes of many people on this comment board.

    They got paid to sweep this incident under the rug and posted a bogus update in an effort to pacify the ignorant people of this community. How pathetic some people are indeed.

  51. Why the conspiracy?

    Family loved this women so much? Why would they not want justice?

    All this gray area.

    A suicide in her own home, or a note at the scene would not have brought so many questions to this incident.

    Had this lady indeed committed suicide why did she feel the need to execute this in a public place?

    It’s a plan true fact. Women commit suicide by poisoning over hanging.

    Could it be that the sheriffs were unable to locate the “famous” screaming lady that early morning because she was inside of this dumpster enclosure?

    We need answers. That’s what will end all this back and forth. And will give these family members who think we are out to disrespect them Justice that they deserve whether they want it or not.

    I have no intentions whatsoever to disrespect this lady nor her family.

    • is it possible that a security guard walked by and shut the doors without looking inside? Is it possible the dog walked away at the same moment? Is it possible that it latches on its own like a gate when you shut it? Stop reaching and leave the family alone.

      If you need to know for safety reasons, it is always best to assume that when you are walking outside, that you are not safe. Follow the rules you are taught when you are a kid. Safer in numbers, stay out of dark areas, avoid strangers, etc. Whatever happened that night should not change what you do. It is a sad world that we have to be like this, but regardless of what occurred that night, it is reality. If someone came out and told you that this was a murder, is it going to change the way you behave? It was not too long ago that a girl was abducted at a grociery store parking lot in broad daylight? Since you knew the “truth”, did you change the way you do things. Really people. If you want this kind of intrigue, move to a big city.

  52. Anyone can come up with theories, the problem is the police are holding back information.
    And no, the gate does not have a latch that comes down on its own, it slides back and forth. Secondly, the guards are not there after midnight which is when the screaming was heard, and when I truly believe she was out there. I highly doubt there were two woman in distress that night, in the same area. Don’t read this if it bothers you. No one is bothering the family, they are writing in to us. Don’t read this if it upsets you. Same goes for the family, concentrate on your grief, if you truly believe what you believe, then it doesn’t matter what we think or say.,

    • besides all the theories, there are facts mentioned and disused on here as well.
      I agree that if people are offended they shouldn’t be keeping up to date on this discussion.

    • 1. Police are holding back information…..THEORY
      2. I think many of the folks on here are watcthing too many soaps trying to create and issue that is not there
      3. I highly doubt there were two woman in distress that night….THEORY. A roulette wheel in Vegas just had seven pop up several times. Unlikey yes, but not impossible.

      • lastly, these “facts” that you say are published on here are coming from people who are hiding their identities. If these folks with facts have something to add, go to the police in person. Anybody can say what they want here. They can say they were related, but it is not proven. They can say they were a friend, but is cannot be proven. They can say they were a witness, but that is not proof.

  53. Ignorance…

    1.The body was right behind the hinges on the door. Highly doubt the guard could not have seen the body, really. It would have been seen even if the door was cracked an inch. in the picture from the mt democrat you can see the leash tied to the pole by the door.

    2. I have driven by and observed the door and its latch is like the one here.
    These type of latches do not latch on its own.
    Don’t believe me take a look from the photos over at the mt democrat.

    • So it is impossible that a security guard sees a door open and walks up and closes it. He could easily walk up to the side of the door push it closed and keep walking. I am not saying I am right, just saying it could happen. Too many narrow minded people who cannot accept that things can happen. If you all beleive their is a consipiracy, go to the Sherrifs office. I doubt posting all your theories on this paper is going to make them come out and say, you know what, we are sorry, we are covering up what really happened. If you are all so sure that they are hiding something, take another action than posting your one way theories here.

      • concerned and concerned2 one in the same?

        tiverbrook… if they went to the Sheriffs dept to get information or to give them their theories they would no longer have a need to get on this page and continue the back n forth senarios. Edh kid, I dont think it is wise to assume that because the family accepts the facts as they are and are not buying into the “cover up” theories doesnt mean they dont or didnt really love her…. maybe they love her enough to allow her to finally rest in peace. Im just saying….

        • Maybe the immediate family is unaware of the screams that night. Whatever tho every person is entitled to there own opinion. No one is pushing there theories on anyone else. Well besides the family who insist it was suicide and is angered that were not buying it.

          • concerned and concerned2 one in the same?

            EDH KID…. We are not angry because “you are not buying it” the fact that she committed suicide. What we are concerned about and have been concerned about from the start of this little CSI unit is what her young boys may read….or hear. I am not optimistic that concern for them will help in the matter either.

  54. Maybe someone should ask the sheriff deputies if they looked over the surveillance footage from the Target parking lot.

    Its truly sad this woman lost her life that night, but its also said she isn’t important enough to have a complete thorough investigation, whether it be suicide or not.

  55. No I don’t know if it has been looked at or not. In believe tho if it has been seen and it clearly showed the women walking inside the enclosure alone with her dog behind here then that would be the nail in the coffin to shut all this BS down.

    I used to run my RC cars there late at night because the parking lot would be empty and there was plenty of lighting. Hopefully the cameras could have caught some footage.

  56. What is the height from the pole to the ground I wonder? Doesn’t look very high…she was about my height and I think I’d have a hard time doing that correctly in that area.

    • Really Anonymous? This is why the family said leave it alone. Now you want to analyze how it happened. Maybe all of you CSI agents can gather there tonight and reinact the events that happenend.

  57. LOL…come on…please realize the entire reason I even said that was to get a rise out of you since today seems to be your full of hate day.

    • sooo not full of hate, just think the speculation is out of control and your comment might seem insensitive. Glad you can joke on here though. I think most people are bothered on this sight because they want to know details that are none of their business. It is like a schoolyard secret they were left out of.

  58. @Tiverbrook, clearly you are clueless…we do not have police we have a sheriff’s deparment…and YES IT IS MY BUSINESS TO KNOW. IT IS MY COMMUNITY and you just want this to go away and be swept under the carpet…stop reading if you believe what the EDSD is selling.

    • concerned and concerned2 one in the same?

      You know what you are unbelievable… whether it is the Sheriffs department or the Police department the point is if you have theories about what happened (which I believe you just want to keep this going because you have nothing else to do…) Go to the police/sheriffs… This woman did have children and she had dealings with alot of children so people like you that put out unfounded rumors are completely irresponsible. Hopefully the people that will be celebrating 4th of July at the town centre have better things to do instead of continuing to stir up suspension about something that has already been investigated. (unlike you and the other concerned) If you have a TRUE suspension of your police/sheriff department witholding informatioin or being a part of a coverup, I would hope you would be somewhat responsible and concerned about children you may be affecting with your conspiracy craziness… and take the issues you have to the police/sheriffs department, mayor, councilmen somebody…. Ill pray for your neighbors… ugh!

    • Really, that is what you can come back with. Sorry. I used the word police as it is used in dictionary. Here is the definition: an organized civil force for maintaining order. I did not capitalize it nor did I say the EDH police. It was the general term. I think some people need to have drama in their lives and so they come here and create it. What am I sweeping under the carpet? Until there are more hard facts or the family is saying that something is not right, then I will respect their wishes. If you are so certain there is a cover up, stop whining about it and go to the SHERRIF’S Department. I doubt they are reading your concerns here.

    • You want to split hairs, you’re that desperate and that big of a blow hard?

      I believe I live in this community too! So NO it is not YOUR community in the sense that you say MY! Before attacking others I suggest you check yourself

  59. For having such a large community full of wealthy people its clear the majority is ignorant. Or possibly they have been sheltered their entire life and have no street smarts.

    A person in the act of hanging themselves is unable to scream for help. It takes just seconds to become unconscious, then minutes to loose muscle tone then movement.

  60. This guy who found the body I wish could clear the whole was the door latched of not upon the discovery. If it was left open you mean to tell me nobody seen the body hanging inside the entrance of the enclosure up until 9am? I mean this happened in a busy parking lot with plenty of traffic on foot and in vehicle.

  61. Silly people, why dont you take your argument somewhere else. Stop bashing everyones opinoin that their entitled to. Please let people speak their thoughts on the matter as long as there is no disclosure of this ladies private information.

  62. To Tiverbook and concerned-
    I did go to the police. I called the police twice the night of the screaming in fact, in which they didn’t take me seriously until I called them the second time. By then it was too late. Then I call the police the day after this woman was found and gave them all the information of what we heard that night, some of which I havn’t shared here. I also called some other officials I won’t say, because I don’t want to give myself away.I also notified the public that there were 911 calls and reports of screaming coming from the same area this woman was found, to let them know its not so cut and dry, because they do have a right to know. So I am doing something unlike you two who have nothing better to do than spew hateful reterick. Everyboy’s voice has a right to be heard here whether you like it or not. I do not understand your anger, If you don’t agree, just say I don’t agree. No one else here is out to insult anyone, so, be mature (especially you concered with the lower case c), and lets discuss this inteligently. If your motive is for us not to discuss our views at all, when then I suggest you go to another blog site where there are people who share your views only.

    • Yes I know I miss spelled intelligently, I have a new computer and I’m still getting use to the keys.

    • concerned and concerned2 one in the same?

      No one is angry and we too have a right to our opinion… and it is my opinion that you are implying cover ups and suspension by merchants of the town center, the police/sheriff departments, and God knows who else…. and it is my opinion that it is irresponsible..to continue to do so when the authorities and the family beleive and accepted that the findings of the Sheriffs are correct…. you said you went to the police/sheriff and “other officials” did they do anything? do they agree with you? did they tell you they did their investigation and have communicated the findings on this very news venue? I am not trying to be nasty to you but it is my opinion that you are in need of some help to let go and move on from this….

      • That’s your opinion, now why don’t YOU get some help and move on! And no, police didn’t tell me anything because they didn’t care enough to investigate! Whether or not you are trying to be nasty, you are being nasty, ugly and insulting. I just hope that if something happens to me, God forbid, there are less people like you, and more people who actually care, and arn’t going to buy any load of crap the police officials dish out! The suspicion comes from the lack of investigation and information, and I don’t appreciate you trying to make me out to be some nut. I heard those screams, you didn’t. It wasn’t what she was screaming, it was how she was screaming, like her life depended on it, for 40 long minutes! All coming from the same area, where this woman was found. You don’t like hearing this, well too bad. Those are the facts. If police don’t think the woman screaming that night is the same woman found dead the next morning, then why havn’t they investigated the possibility of another crime. You keep saying if the poice say its a suicide then it must be. Are you really that nieve? Now, you keep saying the family has accepted its a suicide. How the hell do you know? Do you know ALL the family? You asked if the sheriffs comunicated with me on their findings. If that were the case we wouldn’t be here now would we?? The sheriffs are not communicating with anyone! Now, why don’t you stop, stay out of this because you have no insight on this what so ever, where as I DO! Like it or not!

        • As we can all agree, we have our own opinions. I have to ask, if this is so newsworthy, why havent the major news networks been involved? Sacbee, nightly news, etc? They would be eating this up. Mabye not much is being said because they do not want to glorify suicide. If there was a cover up, you can bet someone investigative reporter would be all over this. Last school year, a high school student took his life. Nothing was said, but it affected so many.

          There is always a chance of a conincidence that something else did happen that night, especially since the timing is off. Another crime could have been committed and no one has come forward. It could have been domestic abuse, someone on drugs being paranoid, anything. Just because they cannot tie the two together does not mean the police, or should I say sherrif, did not do their due dilligence.

          The main fact is that the time of death was hours before the 911 calls. With that said, either the coroner is in on the conspiracy or there just was not one.

          I have heard screams of abuse and know that the sounds never leave, but will eventually fade.

        • concerned and concerned2 one in the same?

          Okay I am done trying to be nice… How the hell do I know??? because I am her family you idiot and we do know that she committed suicide as it has been said in many (not just by family but friends as well) she suffered from mental illness for years. BUT YOU DONT WANT TO LISTEN!!!!! I am sorry you heard screams, as my neice said its already difficult for us to deal with her death and to know that she was possibly calling out for help and no one was there to help her to deal with what was going on in her mind is even more difficult. But to have someone like you continuing to spread rumors about a cover up with the merchants at the town center or the police/sheriff department is something we find appaulling…but because no one is giving you “information” because you are a busy body you continue this crap and refuse to accept FACTS…you continue. I am not trying to make you out to be some nut, but if your real difficulty is hearing screams I think you need to get some help and if your real issue is that you dont know all the details of my sister life and why she chose to take her life this way… I WILL SAY AGAIN… IT IS NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS

          • Sorry to hear about your loss

          • concerned and concerned2 one in the same?

            Thank you Tiverbrook… I really appreciate that, I apologize for becoming frustrated but this ongoing conspiracy crap is really getting on my nerves. There is not one…

          • So I’m an idiot because you didn’t identify yourself! I have done nothing but tell the story of what I heard that night, and have been attacked ever since. When a person dies under those circustances, in a very public place, there are going to be questions. If you are truly family, STOP READING THIS! This isn’t helping you. You need help more than I, you suffered a loss! I’ll say it again, police need to make a formal statement and clear the air, because THIS IS OUR BUSINESS! You want to angry at someone, then be angry at the police, because they handled this very poorly. You win, I’m done, I’ve done everything I can, If the family is truly satisfied, God Bless.

    • Concerned-

      I have been insulting? Really? I’ve seen your post on MD crying about people attacking you here, although I’m not quite sure who you were implying did, but I do believe you have hurled a few attacks at me…..
      Who made you Den Mother ……I do believe you said that to me…..mature?
      You have accused me of being part of the conspiracy – merchant, sheriff’s dept and called me suspicious. Is this what you refer to as a mature conversation?

      Anyone here who goes against the conspiracy theory has been refer to as ignorant and told “if it bothers you stop looking” (to quote you) among other nasty things. I don’t believe I ever refered to anyone as ignorant
      or questioned anyone’s intelligence.

  63. What have I said that is angry. I have shared my opinions as with everyone else.

  64. O i bet the sherrifs and detectives would just love this story brought up to other news stations. And have there work be questioned OMG.

  65. I think everyone would STFU on here if someone just effing clarified whether or not the doors were latched. For real.

  66. At concerned…I think the police, ooops sherrif, did make a formal statement via this newspaper. Are you unsatisfied because it is not what you want to hear. What exactly did the sherrif do or did not do that makes you say they handled it poorly. The time of death was hours before the screams. That is a fact. Regardless of the gate being latched or not, the victim could not be screaming during the time you called 911. The question is, who did you hear screaming? Sound carries in this town. I live two miles away from the Town Center but can hear the bands play during the summer. Until additional evidence presents itself, there is nothing anyone can do.

  67. ok.. I have been following this story for various reasons,and I can’t keep my mouth shut anymore. Some of you need to shut the hell up and quit stirring the pot. I know for a FACT that Target got all of this on video and the police have seen it. They know what happened. It’s for the family to know the details. If there was a murderer on the loose in EDH (heaven forbid!) you would know.. end of story. Leave this family alone. Go back to your perfect little bubble.

  68. let it go-
    Fact- the security cameras on the front of target are dome cameras which only cover a range of 50-100 ft, and as you get further in distance the clarity gets worse. The dumpster inclosure in which this woman was found was way further than that, and to the left. You are full of it, and a liar. Shame on you! There are only two things we know for a fact, one is a woman was found hung by a dog leash in a dumpster inclosure, and two, there were 911 calls reporting a woman screaming for help. Those are the only two things we know for a fact!

  69. I’ve talked to several people who think it’s a cover up…they even say the family is insisting on the suicide story to protect themselves. Geez…the rumors are out of hand.

    • If that’s truly how you feel,, and how your friends feel, and you care enough to do something about it, you can call the District Attorney of El Dorado Hills. His name is Vern Pierson, and phone number is 916-358-3555. You can call him and tell him why you think there’s a cover up.

      • I didn’t say that’s how I feel. I’m just stating what people are saying. I don’t know enough about what they claim to know to report anything. Sorry.

  70. One more thing….I find it disturbing that I haven’t seen her obituary or even heard of a funeral or anything. Some of us did know her and would like to pay our respects but I guess privacy is just too important? Whatever.

  71. I just found out who this was Monday. My heart new but it was finally confirmed. I have been phoning/texting her since the incident. If the family has her phone would you please contact me. If there is anything I can do let me know. She was a wonderful friend and will be truly missed by myself and my daughter! We are very saddened at this loss.

    • just wondering

      I am so sorry for your grief and loss. Just wondering, .Do you have any idea how or why it was, that “in your heart” you knew/suspected this was your friend who was found hanging? Just seems odd/curious that a particular person would come to mind. Was there something specific that lead you to think it was a this woman? Was it a gut feeling? Or . .something else?? My heart goes out to you.

  72. Stop the Speculation

    Someone just say who she was and stop the speculation and conspiracy theories.

  73. breaks my heart … what a good dog to wait there all night.

  74. Why would anyone think there is anything suspicious going on here??. .I mean really. . . let’s review: A well loved, Caucasian woman in her 40’s, living in an upscale/trendy (quasi-suburban) small town, . . a loving mother and teacher, popular in her community, loved by many, who is in the midst of a divorce, turns up dead in a very busy & popular shopping center, HUNG BY HER OWN DOG’S LEASH! .With her much loved, loyal canine lingering nearby, the very morning after MULTIPLE parties heard prolonged, anguished cries/pleas for help in the night by a distressed woman, lasting for an hour . . Those cries were reported to authorities by several different persons, via multiple 911 calls, & included very specific info indicating the cries sounded as if they might be coming from Towne Center (recall that all 911 calls are recorded!) Then less than eight hours after the last screams were last heard around 01:30 . . a woman’s body is found hanging in a dumpster enclosure in Towne Center. ..One of the young men discovering the body reports her dog had been milling about the area since he arrived at 05:45 . . and that the solid, heavy duty, external latch on the dumpster enclosure was latched CLOSED when they arrived. (The various restaurants in the center take out their garbage late in the evening as well .. so it’s not as if this area is totally abadoned). Initial report by Sgt Jim Byers of EDCSO reports the entire scenario is way out of the ordinary, highly suspicious. . then LESS THAN 24 hours later it is declared a “suicide” in the local papers (WAY before any post-mortem exam could ever be carried out). . . NO comments in the tv news, very little in local newspapers, no obituary, no announcements, no notification of friends (despite repeated attempts to contact the woman per posting of ‘A Friend’ on this blog), No explanation ever proffered by authorities or citizens of any reasonable alternative explanation for the prolonged, desperate cries for help by a woman that evening . . . And lastly . all of this is followed by an explosion of angry, BULLYING anonymous blog posters.in a hostile attempt to intimidate the contigent of sincerely concerned, sympathetic and frightened EDH citizens, discussing this tragedy . .. into silence!!. . All the while the blogging bullies offer up only the LAMEST of explanations about why this issue should no longer be discussed/investigated or reviewed. Those cheap CCTV cameras of Target show only the graniest, black & white footage, cannot focus on distant objects, and see even less in the dark! Of course the deceased woman’s family deserves respect, and privacy. . . which is EXACTLY why they would not be spending their time on this site. This is a public safety issue. Anytime a person is found dead in such a popular, public venue, it is of concern to all local residents, and should remain so, unless and until there is a definitive and credible explanation issued as to what truly happened (by an identifiable source in authority). Ponder this: If this truly WERE a suicide (which is highly doubtful) then EDH residents should batton down the hatches until they learn who was screaming that night, and why. Women & children should NOT be out walking/biking alone at night, esp after dark. Lastly consider the specifics of this situation: . .. Women RARELY hang themselves as a means of suicide., especially not a woman who dearly loves her children (regardless of a history of depression & divorce), and is well loved in her community. And a woman would SURELY not commit such an act with her own beloved dog’s leash!. NO WAY/NO HOW. That very detail alone indicates an extraordinary level of ‘personalization’ . ie- someone who knew her well, was full of rage and wanted to inflict the most personal and degrading insult. It’s the ultimate acting out of the message. . . “screw you.” This whole scenario has all the earmarks of the typical “48 Hours Mystery” episode. While my heart and prayers go out to this poor woman, her children and all those who loved her. . I firmly believe it is only a matter of time until the real story here surfaces. I suspect that with the initial silence surrounding this tragedy (and quite probably the mis-handling of this situation by the Sheriff’s office)and the subsequent lack of information issued. . .it won’t be until school resumes , .when community members, parents, friends and the like. . reconvene in their social networks and begin one by one to piece this sad story together. We owe a debt of gratitude to the folks who cared enough to dial 911. God bless the family of this woman, the young men who found her, and those who continue to seek the truth.

  75. @Cynical Agree with all above. The fact that our beautiful friend was left in a dumpster in itself makes a “tragic statement.” Why we/her friends were not notified and had to emotionally suffer on a daily basis wondering, praying, hoping that she was not the one… after multiple calls/texts make it very bothersome.

    • I AGREE! The way she talked about her kids and how she talked about her dog (i.e. “My dog might as well be my third child”) makes this entire thing hard to process. She just wouldn’t do that to her dog – she wouldn’t be able to bear the thought of what could happen to him if he was left alone out there all night.

  76. Totally agree 100% with cynical.

    Whoever posted that the target cameras caught all this on tape and the appropriate people have seen it is full of shit period. Just another rich guppie trying to clear the air in his o so outstanding community. Are homeowners worried that their half mill homes may become even of less value if it turns out theres a murderer living in the community, hence the demand it was a suicide.

    Some people cannot think for themselves and they are the ones who are buying this crap.

  77. This cover up reminds me of the story of the boy teenager found hung from a tree in a folsom park but deemed it suicide by Erotic Asphyxiation.When I r ead about that story I could not believe it, just like with this case.So with that story just because they found Erotic asphyxiation On the teens computer they say it was accidental suicide. Like a teen would go get there rocks off in a park that way.

    People don’t use their brain, they believed what the police reported lol.

  78. I’ve come accross some information that might interest those of you who, who are questioning the dectives handling of this case. As of May, Sheriff John D’Agostini has implemented a “Rotational Policy” with its dectectives, which means they are putting all their experienced detectives back on patrol, and putting totally inexperienced patrol officers into dective positions. Go figure, huh?

  79. That’s brilliant, I vote for John Dumbasstoni for sherrif. Wait did I say that right?

  80. just wondering

    Any updates on this incredibly sad story? Are we back to “business as usual” in EDH? Heartbreaking to think that after only three weeks, this woman’s death seem to have become a vanishing footnote. Is apathy the new societal default ? Scientific American Mind reports that empathy levels (our tendency to care about, and share in other’s emotional experiences) in the USA have been steadily declining over the last thirty years. Is this the case in EDH? Surely hope this woman/mother will not be further victimized in death by a frightening combined lack of empathy, and prevailing apathy amongst EDH residents & law enforcement. There are so many excuses for all of us to justify not getting involved, not taking the the time, not caring, not reaching out, not demanding better investigation of this tragedy, etc. If we are really intellectually honest, and at the same time, summon that underlying capacity for empathy. .. .don’t we all have to ask ourselves. . .”what if the woman crying out that night were my sister/mother/daugher/friend , . . . or ME? How would I wish for others to respond?” Or all we all just content to do another night out at Bistro, take the jet skiis out to the lake, and resume “businss as usual” in EDH? Where is our humanity??

  81. WOW! Did you catch that episide of 48 Hours Mystery on tv ( channel 13) tonight? Sure didn’t look good for the EDCSO! They never inteviewed a key witness/neighbor in that situation, evey though Tylar Witt had TOLD the woman she was going to kill her own mother. When the neighbor woman showed up at the scene of the crime and tried to share this info with the EDCSO, they brushed her off and didn’t bother to take any info from her . .. and it was all caught on tape! Sure does not engender much confidence in the EDCSO investigative abilities. Here’s hoping this current scenario doesn’t constitute yet another episode of 48 Hours Mystery. EDH is apparently not the quiet, sleepy little foothills hamlet it’s made out to be. Very bad PR for EDCSO.

    • Her name was not Jane Doe but she is being treated as one. There is “nothing” on the internet with her name, no obituary, no funeral for us to pay respects, no birth record…… It’s as if she never existed. The majority of EDH does not even know she is deceased.

  82. To saddened: yes, that was exactly my point as well. Her death was apparently not sufficiently ‘news-worthy’, and agree, as you said. . .it’s as if she never existed. Also totally AGREE with ‘the majority of EDH does not even know she is deceased’. The “social network’ has come to a halt while school is out for summer, ie.–the normal conversations one might have with neighbors and parents of other school kids, has temporarily halted. It’s as if we are lining in the 1800’s (save for this blog site, of course), where folks are having to hear the news by mouth, long after this poor woman died. Seems as if it would be helpful (therapeutic, healing) for EDH residents to have some sort of memorial service to at least acknowledge the life and passing of her, and pay our respect. Maybe even a candlelight vigil on the lake in Town Center? SOMETHING, anything would be better than nothing. To think this woman died in the center of EDH, and no acknowledgement is made, is bth sad and shameful. Even if her family held a private memorial service, this sort of death (in a very public setting) triggers a grieving process in the community . My guess is there are two camps of folks out there. .those who have no idea of her passing (yet), and those who do know, but are at a loss as to how to pay their respects. A community ‘service’ or vigil may be an effective means for the EDH community to acknowledge her life and death, and to collectively grieve her passing. And YES, thinking loving thoughts and prayers at home are a good start, but as humans, there is also an desire to mourn as a family/tribe/clan/community. Unfortunatley I don’t believe there will be a real sense of ‘closure’ in this scenario for a very long time to come. But a memorial vigil might be a first step in that direction. And as saddened said. . . she was NOT a Jane Doe, so let’s not treat her as Jane Doe.

    • I would love to have a vigil for her as she was a genuine sweetheart. I will talk to some people I know and see if we can work this out. If you want to get together on this let me know. She is in my daily thoughts and prayers but it certainly does not give me closure. God bless you and your kind words “anonymous!”

      • Hello “Saddened”,

        YES! I believe a vigil would be most appropriate and I am willing to do anything necessary to organize/assist in such an event. I am unsure how to contact you further, but will follow the blog. PLEASE let me know how I can help. And my prayers will continue as well. Feel free to use my memorial sentiment posted below if you wish. Thank you.

  83. I remember once Mother Theresa, speaking in public, said that the United States was a far POORER country than India. When a member of the media asked her is she had misspoken . . .she said NO. . .The US is a far poorer country spiritually . . .. as we allow people to die alone, often in nursing homes . . .everyday. . but she said India is a far richer country (again, spiritually) because even the poorest of the poor. . living destitute in the streets, would not be allowed to die alone, they would be cradled, comforted and attended to by strangers if need be. . .but NOT left to die alone. Again, surely we/EDH can do better for this woman. God Bless.

  84. As it stands right now,whether we agree or not, it has been determined that she committed suicide. I do not know personally, but through the grapvine (and I believe it was hinted at in these comments) she was a middle school teacher. If so, she was an authority figure to many pre-teen impressionable kids. I am sure many looked up to her. To publicize her death will put thoughts in kids heads that this is an option when things are tough. I have seen first hand what a suicide in a school envirnoment can do to other kids. They see the attention the dead person gets and decide they want that attention too. Although I am saddened by the loss of any human life, I beleive that this time of quiet is better for the young lives she was to nurture.

  85. If there is a memorial service to be held, I would like to offer my sentiments below for a public service.

    In Memoriam

    We’ve gathered here to let you know, you did not die in vain,
    Though we don’t know all the story, we still can sense your pain.

    A resident, a neighbor, a mother and a friend,
    A teacher loved by many, yet who met a tragic end.

    Our hearts are heavy with despair, for the means by which you died,
    We send our loving thoughts & prayers, so many tears we’ve cried.

    Collectively we grieve your taking of that one last breath,
    Our sympathies go out to all, who mourn you now in death.

    We’ve heard it said so many times, that ‘dog is man’s best friend’,
    And so it was, your canine pal, was with you ’til the end.

    He stayed to guard your body, as your soul passed on above,
    A living, loyal testament of his undying love.

    As we struggle now, we ask ourselves, . . would your life be spared . . .
    If one more person had reached out, and truly showed they cared?

    So from this painful tragedy, one lesson we have learned,
    Is to show our love through actions, whenever we’re concerned.

    As friends and family mourn your passing and gather in this place,
    Our hope & prayer is now you rest, in the comfort of God’s grace.

    A life cut short, all too soon, but this we pledge to thee,
    Your life will be remembered long, by this community.

  86. Sadly, an Oak Ridge High school student commited suicide this past week. He was not even in California, so please do not look for similarities.

  87. Not quite sure what your angle or intention is, tiverbrook. No one here has mentioned or implied any sort of connection, or link between the two incidents, nor ( i believe) would we. Many are simply grieving the loss of this one woman, who was clearly well loved, and will be missed. In theory, I agree with your initial premise that it is not wise to either condone or glamorize any act of abuse, suicide, or violence, with our youth. Granted. However, young people will ultiimately learn the truth, and each family will have the opportunity to address the issue as a family, if they choose to do so. A memorial or vigil is merely intended to give any who wish to attend, the opportunity to gather together to acknowledge this woman’s life, grieve her death, and bid her farewell. It is a tribute to her life and humanity; a farewell, not a venue to discuss/address her death. This sort of grieving process can be therapeutic for many, as each individual can take only what they need/wish, but also has the means to gather en masse, which is comforting, as it relieves the mourner’s sensation of isolation. Again, not sure what your intention was, but to be clear, this is not a conspiracy theory thread. . .it is merely a community of folks wishing to lovingly acknowledge the life and passing, of a woman/teacher/friend from our midst.

    • I agree with you above redirect. Many of us need closure and our friend deserves some form of respect. She loved life and we loved her life back!

      • Saddened….if you feel that way, then make it happen. If she is your friend and you need this, then make it happen. Sometimes we can learn from kids. A young high school boy took his life last week and over 100 students gathered on Sunday night to share stories. His family did not make it happen, the kids who needed closure made it happen. I have spoken to some of the kids that went and they said they sat around and shared funny stories. I think it helped them and it brought more awareness to how wrong this type of death is.

    • Redirect…Have you read the entire post? It is all about a consipiracy theory. I agree that everyone deserves to mourn in the way that comforts them. Maybe those that loved her and want to gather and share stories about her, could learn from the schoolmates of this young boy that took his life. Instead of talking about it on here, just do it. Over 100 kids gathered at the rock on Sunday night to share happy memories of this young boy. For those that love her and miss her, don’t wait for someone to make it happen, make it happen. Gather at a park, the rock, it does not need to be formal and you do not need to have permission from anyone to share the beauty of her life.

  88. Hello “anonymous”,
    I am not certain how we can connect. However, if you have a suggestion I am willing to comply. Thank you for your loving words to our friend! God rest her soul.

  89. Everyone… our family had a celebration of life for my sister in law, friend and all around awesome person this past Saturday. I think it is a great thing if people of her community and friends would like to get together and remember the great person she was and the many lives that she touched in her short 48 years on this earth. I would love to attend myself, the loss I feel of my friend is immense but not just for my own selfish need for her in my life but the world lost an amazing, kind and loving person. During the celebration of her life as I looked around the room and listened to the people that knew her and I was struck mostly by the impact I saw she had on so many young people, the neices, nephews, counsins and students she had taught or tutored over the years. I and many of the people that knew her will desperately miss her and SHE WILL NOT BE FORGOTTEN!!! She was deeply loved and admired by all that knew her. Again, I would love to attend whatever gathering that is coordinated and would also love to share with all of you this amazing person that had become my sister in law but touched my life and heart as a GREAT FRIEND. God Bless all of you for you love and concern for her in her passing.

  90. @ Just wondering. I had been calling/texting her for days then a week and no answer. I was praying and hoping that is was not her…..but since she did not respond my heart knew. I found it odd that no one phoned to let me know. Thank you for your kind words it does help.

  91. Abs - I CAN RELATE TO THIS STORY. Addressed to the family....

    TO THE FAMILY/FRIENDS OF THIS WOMAN – first off, I want to say I’m terribly sorry for your loss. This breaks my heart to know that a person was in such emotional distress right down the street from my home and I wasn’t able to help her. She seemed like a wonderful lady….

    I have one question to the friends/family members in regards to their loved one who committed suicide. 

    If this is too personal to answer, I totally understand your wish for privacy.  But I need to ask –
    Was she on medication for depression? The REASON I ASK is because my family and I have experienced several suicide deaths in the past 3 years alone that were triggered by antidepressants. Medications of these sorts are KNOWN TO CAUSE SUICIDAL THOUGHTS AND/OR ACTIONS. And when you mix that with a brain & heart that’s already enduring a great deal of pain – these poor souls don’t stand a chance.

    My family and I are becoming very concerned and outraged at the pill-pushing epidemic brought on by greedy physicians and pharmaceutical companies that seem to be aimed at these extremely fragile and vulnerable people who are in mental distress, which ONLY leads to them ending their lives rather than making them “feel better”. I would really appreciate any information on this. I REALLY don’t want to sound nosey either – if this is asking too much – then don’t even worry about responding, I totally respect and understand that.

    But my heart, like yours now, is still hurting from my Aunt who suddenly took her life in 2009. She was an incredible mother of a beautiful son and daughter, amazing sister to my Mother, a loving daughter, aunt, friend, the list goes on. My Aunt stated in her suicide letter that the antidepressants were not making her feel “right” and that she’s “not sure if her psychiatrist knows what they are doing”. I would do anything to go back in time and to have been able to save her. 

    And now, a dear family friend of ours just committed suicide 2 weeks ago after taking antidepressants for a week, and you could imagine our concern and outrage has increased after this too. 

    Again – I don’t want to sound nosey or weird asking about her medical information, but when I heard this story and read these comments, I was very concerned and curious if antidepressants were the culprit of this tragic suicide, just like my Aunt’s and friend’s. 

    If you can let me know, I’d appreciate it. I do not want specifics. I’d just like to know if she was being medicated on these drugs for depression or not. Thank you… 


    My heart and prayers go out to this woman and her friends/family, I know what they are going through all too well. You are all in my prayers, keep your head up and CELEBRATE the memories and the time you were blessed to have been able to spend with her. GOD BLESS YOU. <3

    If you want to learn any more information of the dark side of antidepressants – watch "Marketing of Madness". It can be found on YouTube. Thanks for letting me share…

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